Saturday, March 10, 2012

top ten reasons to go vegan

 In a comment on my previous top ten carnist phrases/excuses that drive me crazy post, I mentioned that I might compile a vegan list as well, so here goes. The Top Ten Reasons to go vegan are:

  1. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  2. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  3. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  4. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  5. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  6. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  7. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  8. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  9. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us
  10. other animals shouldn't have to suffer and die for us

 

  1. it's better for personal health
  2. it's better for the environment
  3. it has the potential to increase global peace
  4. it has the potential to decrease global hunger
  5. it'll expand culinary experience (your palate will thank you!)

There you go, my hand-picked top ten, snort. I included reasons 11-15, but really, they could easily be thought of as benefits primarily for human animals as opposed to reasons per se. Because what struck me as I was Googling top ten lists was how many did not have animals at the TOP of their list. Human concerns such as living longer, better, healthier and even sexier, for Pete's sake, seemed to crowd out concern for other sentient beings. Well, as nice as those things may be, they're not the primary reason I became vegan. For me, it's all about the top ten. Okay, I can see why these lists would be put together the way they are to entice others to join the fold, but we know better, eh? ;)

Comments

Krissa said...

"Because I said so". Ha. That's the reason my parents gave us as kids for a lot of things. ... I don't know statistically how many folks become vegan because of a reason they were given by another human. I tend to think that most of us who find the right path are led there by non-humans. But I could be wrong. I do know that if we try to convince our fellow man who aren't vegan to become so, we have to use arguments that give *them* something. They won't do it for the other animals if they're still in the mind set of having to be argued into it. That's just my opinion and I could be wrong about that, too. But what I'm getting at is, the main factors to motivate someone are monetary/vanity/sex because that sadly is what's most important to most of our kind. That being said, the reason I can think of that would motivate at least plenty of women is that:

16. Your skin will look better.

There's others, but I think that one would bring a lot of people around all by itself. And what I wish people would do is just try it. Start off by telling themselves, "ok, I'm not committing to this forever, I'm going to try it for 6 months and if I don't like it I can go back.". Because if people would really try that, I think a huge percentage of them would stick around. If they aren't doing it from personal conviction, they might not remain lifelong vegans, but I think there's a good chance that many would. So I wonder what a good way to motivate people to do it on a trial basis would be.

have gone vegan said in reply to Krissa...

Yeah, I think there has to be an opening of the heart and mind before a person goes vegan. And I too will rattle off the health, environmental and global benefits in addition to the primary goal of eradicating animal use and abuse when talking to folk.

As for a trial basis, I know there are 30-day vegan challenges around, and that's probably a good way for people to get exposed to veganism if they feel they can't make a long-term commitment yet. So maybe we need to promote that avenue more?

veganelder said...

I really like number 4 and number 3 and numbers 1,2,5,6,7,8,9 and 10...the others are sort of side effects of not being a lousy citizen of the community of life. :-)

Great post...you're back in the groove. :-)

have gone vegan said in reply to veganelder...

Back in? You mean I was out? ;)

veganelder said...

Only in terms of frequency, not in terms of excellence. :-)

have gone vegan said in reply to veganelder...

So much for groovin'. Had to fill in (full-time!) for other people at work. Talk about cutting into blogging time, sigh... But thanks Vee. :)

Bea Elliott said...

Number 1 is the best reason of all - Everything else is just a bonus. Thanks for sharing a great thought! ;)

have gone vegan said in reply to Bea Elliott...

I agree about number 1 and the bonuses. Thanks Bea!

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012

top ten carnist phrases/excuses that drive me crazy

 Speaking of crazy, is it true that Melanie Joy is now being considered a "new welfarist" by some abolitionists after having written An Introduction to Carnism? I haven't read it myself yet, but that would seem like a stretch. Even if the main focus of animal use in her book is on eating meat, surely it's recognized that while she's dealing with one form of speciesism, she's not denying there are others? Anyway, Top Ten, take it away!

Top Ten Carnist Phrases Or Excuses That Drive Me Crazy:

10. "I respect your personal choice, so you have to respect mine."

 9.  "But what would happen to all the animals otherwise?" 

 8.  "It's not natural because you have to supplement with vitamin B12."

 7.  "The proof is in our teeth."

 6.  "Our brains wouldn't have gotten so big without meat."

 5.  "God said we could."

 4.  "But plants have feelings too!"

 3.  "If lions can kill gazelles..."

 2.  "top of the food chain"

 1.  "circle of life"

Obviously there are more than ten annoying excuses and phrases and no doubt you have your own favourites (let us know in the comments!), but the above ten seem to rankle me the most. Or at least, the quickest. The last two in particular really bother me because they're lazy clichés that folk frequently spew out to justify their habits so that they don't have to spend any real time contemplating why they do what they do.

For a complete dismantling of the above lame phrases and excuses (plus many more) check out Vegan Poet's comprehensive responses to typical comments so that you'll always know how to reply to those still not vegan yet. I'd do it myself, but I'm lazy too. ;)

Comments

Jill said...

Ack. Having trouble leaving a comment for some reason. Trying again...

I've been working on my own Top 10 Objections blog post for a while and am glad to see this one as it includes several that didn't make my list. B-12, Circle of Life, Brains? Uggggh. I've noticed that the ONLY time carnists don't come back at me with an excuse is after they have seen a video like Farm to Fridge, Earthlings or Meet Your Meat. The graphic images seem to bypass the rationalizing portions of their brains and go straight to their hearts. But I suppose once the "shock" wears off and they have a Taco Bell craving, those rationalizations might just bubble back up again. Depressing.
And for the record -- I think Melanie Joy is AMAZING. :-))

have gone vegan said in reply to Jill...

Have you read her Strategic Action for Animals yet? I just got it, and it looks like it'll be very good.

Looking forward to your Top 10 post! Sadly, I bet we could both come up with a top 25 even. Like you said, ugh. Maybe I'll have to put together a Top Ten Reasons to go Vegan list to cheer myself up -- or, since I bet a bunch of them have been done already, compile a list of the best of them! :)

veganelder said...

When I get the plants have feelings doodah I know I'm dealing with someone grasping for straws. :-)

have gone vegan said in reply to veganelder...

Yeah. It may be different if you're vegan already and feel you want to expand your compassion to plants as well, but usually this rationalization is done by non-vegans as an excuse to keep consuming what they do.

Krissa said...

I didn't come up with one to add to the list, but my mom said something once that is as close as we've come to having an argument about it (I've explained why I am the way I am and never really gotten any response). I was going through a pretty rough time and while I know she was trying to think of things to say and maybe steer my mind away from my problems, she raved about some chicken sandwich at some fast food place and said she realized I don't eat meat, "but if you ever have a weak moment".... So I wrote back and gently explained again why I am the way I am and that it truly isn't possible for me to have a weak moment in this particular area. We didn't have an argument about it and that was the end of that, but I was honestly surprised to hear that: "if you have a weak moment". I think a lot of people don't understand us at all. I think they don't realize this is something deep within us. So, this isn't really about an excuse-argument I've been confronted with, but it was surprising and depressing to hear.

have gone vegan said in reply to Krissa...

Weak moment, eh? Seems to me like meat-eaters have a continual series of weak moments, snort. But it sounds like your mom thinks of veganism as a diet, like my own mom does whenever she says, "Can't you have just a little bit?" Sigh.

Rebecca said in reply to Krissa...

Five and a half years as a vegan, and my mom has just recently (I think) given up the notion that I'm on "just another fad diet."

have gone vegan said in reply to Rebecca...

My mom STILL (after 7 years of being vegan) will say something to the effect of, "Maybe it's because of what you eat?" every single time I have any kind of physical ailment. And what kills me is that meat-eaters will almost never get asked this same question even though in their case it's that much more pertinent.

Beaelliott said...

I love these! Mine are all the same - Maybe in a different order.

And like VeganElder mentioned the "screaming carrots" always makes me wonder if I should continue the conversation (with an ignoramus) or... Are the plant-pain issue placed there simply to inflame? Either way - Face palm.

A variation of #9: The animals are already dead (Or) Going to die anyway. (sigh)

But - My favorite to respond to is #7 for a few reasons: I like reminding folks that humans have "cuspids" and nonhumans have canines. I also like to suggest that we try to evolve beyond our dentures. To paraphrase Colleen Patrick-Goudreau: "Do we really want to use the behavior/anatomy of the Neanderthals as the yardstick by which to measure our current moral choices?"

As far as Melanie Joy is concerned - A fantastic mind - And a lovely person! A true advocate I'm proud to have on our side of reason and compassion. A "carnist" mindset is not one that just allows the (single issue) of "food animal" use - But extends to the whole concept of "othering". Her theories are insightful, relevant and thought provoking. I don't agree with anyone who discredits her work. She's a tireless force of good for our side - ;)

have gone vegan said in reply to Beaelliott...

Thanks for your input, Bea -- it's always appreciated! Funny though, but when I came to the last paragraph I thought it could just as easily have read as follows:

As far as Bea Elliot is concerned - A fantastic mind - And a lovely person! A true advocate I'm proud to have on our side of reason and compassion. Her theories are insightful, relevant and thought provoking. I don't agree with anyone who discredits her work. She's a tireless force of good for our side - ;)

Keep on rocking, my friend! :)

ta said...

"But my body needs meat". Or howbout "It tastes too good to give up"

have gone vegan said in reply to ta...

Yep, those are good (and annoying) too. Thanks for contributing. And sorry it's taken me so long to respond. :(

JP said...

I just want to say thank you for this site. It really is good that this site exists. Without it, more people would think buying meat is okay, which would drive the prices up.

Thanks to the vegan movement, the price of delicious bacon is kept down, meaning I can have bacon for breakfast everyday of the week. I want to thank all vegans for keeping the price of meat down. Yes, bacon truly is great and delicious.

Though there is no comparison to veal. I especially enjoy having a pregnant cow give birth directly into my sizzling pan. The taste and texture of veal that has never walked a day in its life is truly amazing. And the placenta makes a good garnish, not to mention all the vitamins it has.

have gone vegan said in reply to JP...

I just want to say thank you for this comment. It really is good that it exists.

Without it, more people would think that animal-chomping folk just aren't aware of the cruelty they're committing.

Thanks to your comment though, it's clear that some carnists are just immature, thoughtless, selfish, heartless (brainless?) and ignorant jerks.

Thanks again.

Carnivore said...

I'll never be a weak minded veggitard. Meat is delicious and nutritious, blood is sweet and the flesh tender. You vegetarians are easily the weaker people if words offend you. So sad you mad but you can't convert me, I once tried a month of no meat and after a week I felt horrible, fatuiged and nausious. Eatting meat isnt a lifestyle or a public statement but essential to life. You call us brainless? I've eaten enough brains to not you're full of bullshit, the exact same bullshit that's in your kale shakes. If I could, I would eat one of every animal on this planet. Oh, and how dose it feel to be on the other side of the conversation with a pretentious fuck. Now that my rant is over I'm going to go and eat a delicious steak (medium rare) just to spite you.

Also plants make air breathable while livestock make methane that pollute it, so it seems that veggitards are the real bad guys. Save a plant eat a cow.

have gone vegan said in reply to Carnivore ...

Thank you for the comment Carnivore.

You're right that plants are healthy for the environment and that livestock is destructive, so wouldn't it make more sense to stop producing all those cows and pigs and chickens? Because as you said, all that methane. So thanks for supporting a vegan stance! :)

Also, if you were feeling fatigued and nauseous after a week, then it sounds like maybe you weren't doing it quite right or getting enough calories. Or perhaps your body was still trying to get rid of noxious toxins? Next time, choose from beans, lentils, peas, nuts, peanut butter, spinach, brown rice, barley, broccoli, quinoa, tofu or soymilk, whole grain bread, pasta, sunflower seeds, avocado, etc., etc., (the list of non-animal protein is practically endless), and you'll do just fine. I mean, if vegan bodybuilders can do it, so can you. Good luck!

Rebecca said in reply to Carnivore ...

Why is it that whenever people rant about how meat makes them smart, they misspell every other word?

David said...

Annoying is that your little bitch ass thinks you're above anybody else for living however the fuck they want. So you're a faggot ass vegan? So the fuck what? Grow up, nobody gives a fuck. What's even more pathetic about your shitty little list is how you're going about attempting to convert people. Mind your own business, dickhead mother fucker.

have gone vegan said in reply to David...

Seriously, David? Okay, you know how to swear, I'll give you that. But please, PLEASE, don't make me think that carnists as a whole are truly stupid on top of everything else, because I'm sure that's not the case. Right?

Krissa said in reply to have gone vegan...

David is clearly a troll. It would be interesting to know how they found this post....trolling maybe?

have gone vegan said in reply to Krissa...

Who knows, eh?

Desertwind said...

In regards to #10:

Yes, that would be called mutual respect. What's so wrong with that? Why does that annoy you?

have gone vegan said in reply to Desertwind...

Hi Desertwind, thank you for asking so that I can clarify.

That particular response is one vegans hear an awful lot, and unfortunately is usually said as a way to shut down a conversation that often hasn't even begun. It's also a way of dismissing concern and responsibility for how we treat other animals.

One of the things most frustrating to many vegans though is that the choice to use or not use animals is presented as if it were a personal choice only, instead of a personal AND political AND cultural choice with dire consequences for the animals involved.

It also tends to be presented as if the two choices are morally equivalent, when in fact one of those choices leads to untold cruelty, misery and death. So you can't really give equal weight to those two choices and say that morally they're of similar value. In other words, I (and most vegans) find it really hard to respect a choice that leads to so much needless violence and death.

Hope that helps. Thanks again for asking.

anynomous said...

Other things that are not really arguments but attempts to dismiss my credibility are: ''You're just brainwashed because you spend too much time on the internet and have too much time on your hands to think about these things'',''veganism is a cult, you're too obsessed'' and the common ''there is other problems to care about like human exploitation, you can't be perfect'' and also ''what about humans''. All from my mother. ugh.

have gone vegan said in reply to anynomous...

Ah yes, the old cult, brainwashing, and 'but what about people?' lines. Sorry you have to deal with that. I wouldn't be surprised if some of my family members actually feel the same way, but they probably know better than to verbalize it out loud, snort.

Thanks for contributing. Appreciate it. :)

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